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	<title>Comments on: My beef with Fairtrade</title>
	<atom:link href="http://angryafrican.net/2008/02/21/my-beef-with-fairtrade/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://angryafrican.net/2008/02/21/my-beef-with-fairtrade/</link>
	<description>I have opinions. I am from Africa. I live here now. I blog.</description>
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		<title>By: ethnicsupplies</title>
		<link>http://angryafrican.net/2008/02/21/my-beef-with-fairtrade/#comment-4436</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ethnicsupplies]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 21:43:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://angryafrican.wordpress.com/?p=70#comment-4436</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Interesting blog, and please forgive me for advertising on your blog, but I wrote a blog about this issue earlier today and my views are here

http://ethnicsupplies.wordpress.com/wp-admin/edit-comments.php?p=163#comments

I certainly feel that whilst Fairtrade ahs made huge strides to make things better for farmers, more could done to make things more equitable, and that certification feen should go, as a start]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting blog, and please forgive me for advertising on your blog, but I wrote a blog about this issue earlier today and my views are here</p>
<p><a href="http://ethnicsupplies.wordpress.com/wp-admin/edit-comments.php?p=163#comments" rel="nofollow">http://ethnicsupplies.wordpress.com/wp-admin/edit-comments.php?p=163#comments</a></p>
<p>I certainly feel that whilst Fairtrade ahs made huge strides to make things better for farmers, more could done to make things more equitable, and that certification feen should go, as a start</p>
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		<title>By: Rodney North</title>
		<link>http://angryafrican.net/2008/02/21/my-beef-with-fairtrade/#comment-305</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Rodney North]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Mar 2008 16:13:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://angryafrican.wordpress.com/?p=70#comment-305</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[(my comments continued - I hit &quot;submit&quot; by accident)

Re: having to deal with different organizations for many countries. 
That&#039;s was largely fixed years ago. For ex, manufacturers only need to get one certification for all of Europe.  However, the US &amp; Canada do still operate their own seals. 

Re: the seeming hypocrisy over Nestlé
The Fair Trade movement, just like the organic movement, and workers rights movements is composed of hundreds of organizations, companies, and now millions of people across the globe. Its unreasonable - and a distraction - to suggest that such a collection should speak with one voice. And while Oxfam &amp; others did push Nestle to adopt Fair Trade standards they had wanted a much more substantial response than the token one offered by Nestle. We, too, took Nestle to task over this. To see the fully elaborated argument see: http://www.wedge.coop/newsletter/article/630.html 

Re: only the commodity, &amp; not the processing is certified. 
Good point. As one of the dozen or so worker co-operatives working in the Fair Trade movement we&#039;d agree that the other stages in the value-added chain should be addressed in some way, whether or not Fair Trade certification is the place for that. 
For example, as Zazie says, there is a parallel system (www.ifat.org) that certifies ORGANIZATIONS and COMPANIES, rather than PRODUCTS. Equal Exchange is a founding member of IFAT as well as utilizing Fair Trade certification for our coffee, tea, chocolate, etc.

Other worker co-ops (Cocoa Camino, Planet Bean, &amp; Just Us in Canada, Ethiquetable in France, Alterantiva 3 in Spain) all combine product certification with an alternative, progressive economic model for those other value-added steps you mentioned. 

I could also go on about the critical role of co-ops in economic development, etc. but you can just read some of the dozens of academic studies on this for yourself.   http://www.fairtrade.net/impact_studies.html &amp; http://www.transfairusa.org/content/Downloads/FairTradeAcademicReferences.doc 

I have go back to work  now buying and selling some Fair Trade coffee &amp; tea.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(my comments continued &#8211; I hit &#8220;submit&#8221; by accident)</p>
<p>Re: having to deal with different organizations for many countries.<br />
That&#8217;s was largely fixed years ago. For ex, manufacturers only need to get one certification for all of Europe.  However, the US &amp; Canada do still operate their own seals. </p>
<p>Re: the seeming hypocrisy over Nestlé<br />
The Fair Trade movement, just like the organic movement, and workers rights movements is composed of hundreds of organizations, companies, and now millions of people across the globe. Its unreasonable &#8211; and a distraction &#8211; to suggest that such a collection should speak with one voice. And while Oxfam &amp; others did push Nestle to adopt Fair Trade standards they had wanted a much more substantial response than the token one offered by Nestle. We, too, took Nestle to task over this. To see the fully elaborated argument see: <a href="http://www.wedge.coop/newsletter/article/630.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.wedge.coop/newsletter/article/630.html</a> </p>
<p>Re: only the commodity, &amp; not the processing is certified.<br />
Good point. As one of the dozen or so worker co-operatives working in the Fair Trade movement we&#8217;d agree that the other stages in the value-added chain should be addressed in some way, whether or not Fair Trade certification is the place for that.<br />
For example, as Zazie says, there is a parallel system (www.ifat.org) that certifies ORGANIZATIONS and COMPANIES, rather than PRODUCTS. Equal Exchange is a founding member of IFAT as well as utilizing Fair Trade certification for our coffee, tea, chocolate, etc.</p>
<p>Other worker co-ops (Cocoa Camino, Planet Bean, &amp; Just Us in Canada, Ethiquetable in France, Alterantiva 3 in Spain) all combine product certification with an alternative, progressive economic model for those other value-added steps you mentioned. </p>
<p>I could also go on about the critical role of co-ops in economic development, etc. but you can just read some of the dozens of academic studies on this for yourself.   <a href="http://www.fairtrade.net/impact_studies.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.fairtrade.net/impact_studies.html</a> &amp; <a href="http://www.transfairusa.org/content/Downloads/FairTradeAcademicReferences.doc" rel="nofollow">http://www.transfairusa.org/content/Downloads/FairTradeAcademicReferences.doc</a> </p>
<p>I have go back to work  now buying and selling some Fair Trade coffee &amp; tea.</p>
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		<title>By: Rodney North</title>
		<link>http://angryafrican.net/2008/02/21/my-beef-with-fairtrade/#comment-303</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Rodney North]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Mar 2008 15:51:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://angryafrican.wordpress.com/?p=70#comment-303</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I can understand some of the positions stated here, but as one who has worked in the Fair Trade movement for 12 years (@ www.equalexchange.coop) I&#039;d like to assure that most (&amp; maybe all) of the concerns here ultimately rest upon imcomplete knowledge of how Fair Trade works &amp;/or misunderstandings.

For example, the Fair Trade system does address environmental issues. Go to this pdf fro the global umbrella group for Fair Trade &amp; see pages 7 - 20) http://www.fairtrade.net/fileadmin/user_upload/content/Generic_Fairtrade_Standard_SF_Dec_2007_EN.pdf 

You&#039;ll see that farmers must address issues like soil erosion, composting, waste-water, and a host of other criteria. They may not use approx. 100 of the most problematic agro-chemicals. 

Also, unlike another certification systems, including organic &amp; Rainforest alliance, Fair Trade is the only one that GUARANTEES farmers an extra price premium for going organic. For ex, Fair Trade importers like Equal Exchange have to pay an extra 20 cents/lb if the coffee is certified organic.  20 That&#039;s a significant financial commitment to support organic farmers that no other system requires.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can understand some of the positions stated here, but as one who has worked in the Fair Trade movement for 12 years (@ <a href="http://www.equalexchange.coop" rel="nofollow">http://www.equalexchange.coop</a>) I&#8217;d like to assure that most (&amp; maybe all) of the concerns here ultimately rest upon imcomplete knowledge of how Fair Trade works &amp;/or misunderstandings.</p>
<p>For example, the Fair Trade system does address environmental issues. Go to this pdf fro the global umbrella group for Fair Trade &amp; see pages 7 &#8211; 20) <a href="http://www.fairtrade.net/fileadmin/user_upload/content/Generic_Fairtrade_Standard_SF_Dec_2007_EN.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.fairtrade.net/fileadmin/user_upload/content/Generic_Fairtrade_Standard_SF_Dec_2007_EN.pdf</a> </p>
<p>You&#8217;ll see that farmers must address issues like soil erosion, composting, waste-water, and a host of other criteria. They may not use approx. 100 of the most problematic agro-chemicals. </p>
<p>Also, unlike another certification systems, including organic &amp; Rainforest alliance, Fair Trade is the only one that GUARANTEES farmers an extra price premium for going organic. For ex, Fair Trade importers like Equal Exchange have to pay an extra 20 cents/lb if the coffee is certified organic.  20 That&#8217;s a significant financial commitment to support organic farmers that no other system requires.</p>
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		<title>By: Fair trade is unfair « the spike</title>
		<link>http://angryafrican.net/2008/02/21/my-beef-with-fairtrade/#comment-289</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Fair trade is unfair « the spike]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Mar 2008 07:14:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://angryafrican.wordpress.com/?p=70#comment-289</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] fellow calling himself Angry African posted this link to his own post about Fairtrade as a comment to this piece over at the Mail &amp; Guardian Online&#8217;s blog [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] fellow calling himself Angry African posted this link to his own post about Fairtrade as a comment to this piece over at the Mail &#38; Guardian Online&#8217;s blog [...]</p>
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		<title>By: joe</title>
		<link>http://angryafrican.net/2008/02/21/my-beef-with-fairtrade/#comment-157</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[joe]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Mar 2008 19:55:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://angryafrican.wordpress.com/?p=70#comment-157</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Excellent points.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent points.</p>
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		<title>By: Zazie</title>
		<link>http://angryafrican.net/2008/02/21/my-beef-with-fairtrade/#comment-142</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Zazie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Feb 2008 03:04:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://angryafrican.wordpress.com/?p=70#comment-142</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[You talk about Fairtrade but what about Fair Trade. These are 2 quite distinct systems, one accreditting the product the other the organisation.  There is much confusion between these two, the second loosing credibility because of the first&#039;s focus on certification.
What do you have to say about Fair Trade as IFAT defines it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You talk about Fairtrade but what about Fair Trade. These are 2 quite distinct systems, one accreditting the product the other the organisation.  There is much confusion between these two, the second loosing credibility because of the first&#8217;s focus on certification.<br />
What do you have to say about Fair Trade as IFAT defines it.</p>
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		<title>By: Vasco Pyjama</title>
		<link>http://angryafrican.net/2008/02/21/my-beef-with-fairtrade/#comment-131</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Vasco Pyjama]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Feb 2008 05:50:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://angryafrican.wordpress.com/?p=70#comment-131</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Okay.  From the development practitioner&#039;s point of view -- fairtrade certification system is so damn hard to bring in.  I reckon it takes a minimum of five years to bring in this system.  Why?  As you said, the poorest farmers do not naturally form themselves into cooperatives.  Farming is largely a household activity in many countries.  So we need to go back and first form cooperatives.  The cooperatives need to function and play nicely together (which is damn hard to achieve).  Only then can we start talking fairtrade.  Then you need certification and registration process, yada yada yada.  Essentially, it is something that is almost impossible to do without significant external assistance (eg., from Oxfam).

I was working with cocoa farmers in an earthquake and Tsunami-affected island in Indonesia.  We only had a two year timeframe.  I looked at the whole fairtrade system.  GTZ had brought it in Aceh.  Well, half brought it in.  Well, perhaps a quarter.  We decided to give up before we even started, given that we knew that we wouldn&#039;t be able to finish the job.

*sigh*.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okay.  From the development practitioner&#8217;s point of view &#8212; fairtrade certification system is so damn hard to bring in.  I reckon it takes a minimum of five years to bring in this system.  Why?  As you said, the poorest farmers do not naturally form themselves into cooperatives.  Farming is largely a household activity in many countries.  So we need to go back and first form cooperatives.  The cooperatives need to function and play nicely together (which is damn hard to achieve).  Only then can we start talking fairtrade.  Then you need certification and registration process, yada yada yada.  Essentially, it is something that is almost impossible to do without significant external assistance (eg., from Oxfam).</p>
<p>I was working with cocoa farmers in an earthquake and Tsunami-affected island in Indonesia.  We only had a two year timeframe.  I looked at the whole fairtrade system.  GTZ had brought it in Aceh.  Well, half brought it in.  Well, perhaps a quarter.  We decided to give up before we even started, given that we knew that we wouldn&#8217;t be able to finish the job.</p>
<p>*sigh*.</p>
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		<title>By: sean</title>
		<link>http://angryafrican.net/2008/02/21/my-beef-with-fairtrade/#comment-103</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[sean]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 14:40:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://angryafrican.wordpress.com/?p=70#comment-103</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Check us out at www.beansforhope.com, we created a more than fair trade solution and we deal with one community at a time.  That way there is no dilution of our resources to 10-15 farms at a time. We can focus on one group of people, get the job done and move on. 

Fair Trade seems to be on auto pilot right now and as it comes under more criticism from the coffee farmers who actually get screwed while certified not much will change.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Check us out at <a href="http://www.beansforhope.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.beansforhope.com</a>, we created a more than fair trade solution and we deal with one community at a time.  That way there is no dilution of our resources to 10-15 farms at a time. We can focus on one group of people, get the job done and move on. </p>
<p>Fair Trade seems to be on auto pilot right now and as it comes under more criticism from the coffee farmers who actually get screwed while certified not much will change.</p>
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		<title>By: Justin D-Z</title>
		<link>http://angryafrican.net/2008/02/21/my-beef-with-fairtrade/#comment-96</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Justin D-Z]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Feb 2008 23:06:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://angryafrican.wordpress.com/?p=70#comment-96</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Seems like, on the certification cost side, they could take an approach of sourcing goods samples and verifying for a while (a year?) instead of charging up front.  The overall cost to the person seeking certification is lower, but the process is not free for the applicant and does not require a full &quot;scholarship&quot; by Fairtrade.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seems like, on the certification cost side, they could take an approach of sourcing goods samples and verifying for a while (a year?) instead of charging up front.  The overall cost to the person seeking certification is lower, but the process is not free for the applicant and does not require a full &#8220;scholarship&#8221; by Fairtrade.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim</title>
		<link>http://angryafrican.net/2008/02/21/my-beef-with-fairtrade/#comment-95</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jim]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Feb 2008 18:48:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://angryafrican.wordpress.com/?p=70#comment-95</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I aggree whole heartedly. I have been trying to establish direct relationships with farmers because the money goes directly too them and includes farms that may not be able to belong to fair trade.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I aggree whole heartedly. I have been trying to establish direct relationships with farmers because the money goes directly too them and includes farms that may not be able to belong to fair trade.</p>
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